Forums/Armchair-GM

One overrated player per team

Initial Creation Date: Oct 28, 2020
Published: Oct 28 at 10:41
Team: 2020-21 Custom Team
Team Explanation
On Rakell: everyone seems to think he's an elite or close to that level scorer but in fact he's a 2nd liner
On Kessel: his role is a 2nd line one
On Kase: he just sucks, and is actually a great proof of why analytics don't tell the full story
On Hall: he's not a 80 pts player, he's a 70 pts player
On Gaudreau: he can't carry a team IMO, not when it matters anyway. Tkachuk should be the main guy in CGY, not Gaudreau
On Trockeck: it's time to stop thinking about him as an excellent 2C and we need to start seeing the truth: he's just an average 2C
On Kubalik: he's not the vest invention since sliced bread ok? Very good player yes but he still plays with guys who can drive plays in an elite way, Toews and Kane
On Makar: look, I love the guy, he really is an elite PP quarterback, but he needs to improve his defense before we start including him in top 10 d-men rankings
On Korpisalo: he's great but really his number have to be boosted by CLB's defensive system
On Seguin: he isn't exactly close to making Team Canada IMO, not even sure if he's a top 20 center in the league
On Mantha: he isn't worth the world ok?
On Draisaitl: one of the worst defensive players in the league, he shouldn't have won the Hart and isn't a top 15 centers when it comes to the overall game
On Barkov: he's great but isn't even the best on his team
I couldn't find anyone for LA
On DUmba: he isn't anything more than number 3 d-man
On Tatar: he isn't a top liner, I think his playoff performance showed us that he's just an average 2nd liner
On Duchene: nuff said
I couldn't come up with anyone for NJ, since PK isn't overrated anymore, everyone knows he's a bottom pairing d-man (I'd even argue he's not NHL caliber but that's just me)
On Varlamov: he's a good goalie for sure, but the defensive structure in NYI helps him a lot
On NYR: Kreider could be overrated in 2 years but not now. You could make a case for ADA too.
On Murray: he's not a true starter
On Giroux: dude's not consistent
On DUmoulin: he's very good but not an elite defensive d-man, as I've sen some PIT fans call him. IMO Marino torches him
I honestly don't know who to pick for SJ
On Krug: he's not a very good player, he's only a very good PP player
On Kucherov: I think people overrate him because they see him as TB's best F, when their best F is Point
On Marner: until he shows he can play with the fire he had in the 2018-19 season on a consistent basis he's overrated. Sorry
on Boeser: IMO the presence of EP/Horvat helps him more than we'd like to admit
On Pacioretty: just a terrible playoff performer. He's not a 1st liner when playoff time comes
On Carlson: he shouldn't have been nominated for the Norris. Terrible at defense. Nuff said
On Connor: IMO he's worse than Scheifele and Ehlers who, IMO, play much better 200 foot game than he does
ROSTER SIZESALARY CAPCAP HITOVERAGES BONUSESCAP SPACE
27$81,500,000$162,356,134$0$2,500,000-$80,856,134
Left WingCenterRight Wing
BUF
Hall, Taylor
$8,000,000
LW
NMC
UFA - 1
ANA
Rakell, Rickard
$3,789,444
C, RW, LW
UFA - 2
ARI
Kessel, Phil
$6,800,000
RW
NMC NTC
UFA - 2
CGY
Gaudreau, Johnny
$6,750,000
LW
UFA - 2
CAR
Trocheck, Vincent
$4,750,000
C, RW
UFA - 2
BOS
Kase, Ondrej
$2,600,000
RW
RFA - 1
CHI
Kubalik, Dominik
$3,700,000
LW
RFA - 2
DAL
Seguin, Tyler
$9,850,000
C, RW
NMC
UFA - 7
Mantha, Anthony
$700,000
MTL
Tatar, Tomas
$4,800,000
LW, RW
UFA - 1
EDM
Draisaitl, Leon
$8,500,000
C, LW, RW
UFA - 5
TBL
Kucherov, Nikita
$9,500,000
RW
NMC
UFA - 7
PHI
Giroux, Claude
$8,275,000
LW, C, RW
NMC
UFA - 2
FLA
Barkov, Aleksander
$5,900,000
C
NMC
UFA - 2
TOR
Marner, Mitchell
$10,893,000
RW
UFA - 5
VGK
Pacioretty, Max
$7,000,000
LW
NTC
UFA - 3
NSH
Duchene, Matt
$8,000,000
C, LW
UFA - 6
VAN
Boeser, Brock
$5,875,000
RW
RFA - 2
WPG
Connor, Kyle
$7,142,857
LW
UFA - 6
Left DefenseRight DefenseGoaltender
COL
Makar, Cale
$880,833
RD
RFA - 1
CBJ
Korpisalo, Joonas
$2,800,000
G
UFA - 2
MIN
Dumba, Matt
$6,000,000
RD
UFA - 3
NYI
Varlamov, Semyon
$5,000,000
G
NTC
UFA - 3
PIT
Dumoulin, Brian
$4,100,000
LD
UFA - 3
OTT
Murray, Matt
$6,250,000
G
UFA - 4
STL
Krug, Torey
$6,500,000
LD
NTC
UFA - 7
WSH
Carlson, John
$8,000,000
RD
NTC
UFA - 6

Embed Code

  • To display this team on another website or blog, add this iFrame to the appropriate page
  • Customize the height attribute in the iFrame code below to fit your website appropriately. Minimum recommended: 400px.

Text-Embed

Click to Highlight
Oct 28 at 11:06
#26
I use charts
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 1,888
Likes: 562
Quoting: Stanley_Cup_To_Manhattan
Nylander is underrated.

bq1kibuz0yv21.jpg?width=1199&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7acd785fbc90720eba43a3d509d9a1e2009b410e


To be fair, that is from 16-19

Matthews' defensive game has improved a lot
vr1995 and bunzy1034 liked this.
Oct 28 at 11:07
#27
Goal Perfetti
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 3,363
Likes: 1,447
Quoting: oilersguy
why does Leons defensive game matter when he puts up 50 goals and over 100 points, and the most overrated leaf is Nylander, but 100% agree with Kucherov most overrated player in the league 75-85 guy who plays on a crazy good team. and leon not being a 15 centre what are you talking about he is a top 5 player in the league


Because defence is half the game dude. No matter which way you want to look at it. Everyone who doesn’t use analytics hates on them because they don’t understand them (idk know how because they are super easy to comprehend). In general, teams with some of the best analytics in the league are the best teams. Colorado, St. Louis(Stanley cup champions last year), Tampa bay (Stanley cup winners this year), and Carolina are good examples. I’m not saying Leon is bad because he is still really good, but if he was better in his own end then people would give him even more respect.
Saskleaf liked this.
Oct 28 at 11:07
#28
Lenny7
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 4,403
Likes: 2,317
Quoting: vr1995
if hes elite than your really expanding the definition of elite


0.9 point per game player, who's played on some pretty trash teams. Also has been very good analytically throughout his career. Not sure what everyone's definition of "elite" is, but IMO he's right there, and any team would be lucky to have a player like him.
Oct 28 at 11:08
#29
KwawiisdaGOAT
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 3,995
Likes: 1,493
Quoting: oilersguy
why does Leons defensive game matter when he puts up 50 goals and over 100 points, and the most overrated leaf is Nylander, but 100% agree with Kucherov most overrated player in the league 75-85 guy who plays on a crazy good team. and leon not being a 15 centre what are you talking about he is a top 5 player in the league


I actually have to agree the most overrated leafs is Nylander.
oilersguy liked this.
Oct 28 at 11:10
#30
Goal Perfetti
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 3,363
Likes: 1,447
Kyle Connor definitely the correct choice for the Jets btw
Oct 28 at 11:10
#31
KwawiisdaGOAT
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 3,995
Likes: 1,493
Quoting: KakkoForMauriceRichardAward
Barely a number 6 IMO


He's a moderate number 4.
Oct 28 at 11:10
#32
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 108
Likes: 46
Yeah this is a pretty brutal list buddy
Oct 28 at 11:10
#33
Watches no games
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 763
Oh this will be fun

On Rakell: everyone seems to think he's an elite or close to that level scorer but in fact he's a 2nd liner
Name the 90 forwards in the NHL better than Rakell to make him belong on a second line.

On Kessel: his role is a 2nd line one
He's possibly worse.

On Kase: he just sucks, and is actually a great proof of why analytics don't tell the full story
Today's most empty statement. He's a solid player. Since I can tell you don't know from your previous comment, this is what a second liner looks like.

On Hall: he's not a 80 pts player, he's a 70 pts player
Okay? Since when is points the only decider of player value? Thought you knocked Draisaitl on that. Hall is great in transition and a player driver at elite level, although his last year may be cause for concern.

On Gaudreau: he can't carry a team IMO, not when it matters anyway. Tkachuk should be the main guy in CGY, not Gaudreau
Crazy idea: What if they're both really good, and the issue is that the players around them aren't? Gaudreau has made Monahan look like 1C material for far too long.

On Trockeck: it's time to stop thinking about him as an excellent 2C and we need to start seeing the truth: he's just an average 2C
He was good even for a 1C before his injury. He's not really been the same since, so can't give a definitive answer on this one.

On Kubalik: he's not the vest invention since sliced bread ok? Very good player yes but he still plays with guys who can drive plays in an elite way, Toews and Kane
>Elite
>Toews and Kane

On Makar: look, I love the guy, he really is an elite PP quarterback, but he needs to improve his defense before we start including him in top 10 d-men rankings
He's probably not top 10, but probably close. I'm not sure it's as much defense as it is him not driving all of his own point production, but whatever.

On Korpisalo: he's great but really his number have to be boosted by CLB's defensive system
Yep. Merzlikins is also better.

On Seguin: he isn't exactly close to making Team Canada IMO, not even sure if he's a top 20 center in the league
Kinda agree here. Deffo a bottom half (15-30) 1C.

On Mantha: he isn't worth the world ok?
I don't know what this means. He's really, really good though.

On Draisaitl: one of the worst defensive players in the league, he shouldn't have won the Hart and isn't a top 15 centers when it comes to the overall game
He might still be a top 15C, but I'm curious how you feel about an equally defensively flawed McDavid. I want to do a little consistency check here.

On Barkov: he's great but isn't even the best on his team
The real overrated part is his defensive ability. He always had good underlying numbers, but they just weren't necessarily in regards to defense.

I couldn't find anyone for LA
Did Drew Doughty slip into an existential void?

On DUmba: he isn't anything more than number 3 d-man
Umm... So - again, if you name me 90 better defensemen than Dumba I'll be impressed. Actually, I'll be impressed if you mention 40.

On Tatar: he isn't a top liner, I think his playoff performance showed us that he's just an average 2nd liner
Ah, yes, let's use the smallest sample size possible to judge player ability. I think he's hovering between first and second line, but average 2nd line implies there are 45 wingers on each side - or 90 wingers better than Tatar. This is just incorrect.

On Duchene: nuff said
Well you didn't say anything, but okay.

I couldn't come up with anyone for NJ, since PK isn't overrated anymore, everyone knows he's a bottom pairing d-man (I'd even argue he's not NHL caliber but that's just me)
Not. NHL. Caliber. Again, I don't think you think of these things in terms of real numbers. That means 6 x 31; 186 better defensemen than P.K. In reality he's what, a #3?

On Varlamov: he's a good goalie for sure, but the defensive structure in NYI helps him a lot
Varlamov is a pretty tricky goalie, but what you're saying is probably true. He's been elite before that though, but he bounces a lot between season. This is a fine take I guess.

On NYR: Kreider could be overrated in 2 years but not now. You could make a case for ADA too.
I have a deep, personal, burning hatred for Deangelo. Really. But he's still really good. Kreider is funny to me, cause usually it's the guys with elite tools that are overrated, but he's been underrated for most of his career.

On Murray: he's not a true starter
No, he's garbage.

On Giroux: dude's not consistent
Consistently a top 10-15 winger at least.

On DUmoulin: he's very good but not an elite defensive d-man, as I've sen some PIT fans call him. IMO Marino torches him
I swear if anyone's ever called Dumoulin elite... Marino is really, really good. Like this doesn't say much about anything.

I honestly don't know who to pick for SJ
Perception seems to have caught up on Burns, everyone knows Jones is garbage, but I'd still press on Martin Jones, cause SJS would be a staple playoff team with even average goaltending.

On Krug: he's not a very good player, he's only a very good PP player
He's actually pretty okay 5on5 too. He gets a lot of easy zone starts, but that what you do with offensively skilled players. A very good PP-player can be a very good player.

On Kucherov: I think people overrate him because they see him as TB's best F, when their best F is Point
Kucherov is like a top 5 player in the league over the last couple of years, what do you mean

On Marner: until he shows he can play with the fire he had in the 2018-19 season on a consistent basis he's overrated. Sorry
He's overpaid more than overrated I think. However, I swear every Leafs fan has a crush on Jake Muzzin cause he's burly or something.

on Boeser: IMO the presence of EP/Horvat helps him more than we'd like to admit
H-H-H... Horvat..? The most defensively overrated player in the league?

On Pacioretty: just a terrible playoff performer. He's not a 1st liner when playoff time comes
Again with the playoff talk. Pacioretty is underrated if anything - it seems people forgot he's a solid 1st line winger just cause he left Montreal and turned 30 or something.

On Carlson: he shouldn't have been nominated for the Norris. Terrible at defense. Nuff said
One can still be nominated for the Norris while being trash at defense, as long as your offensive ability makes up for it. He's still really good - I wouldn't go as far as Norris votes, but still good.

On Connor: IMO he's worse than Scheifele and Ehlers who, IMO, play much better 200 foot game than he does
This is of course true, but even more true for Laine who's like the 4th best winger on that team.
Oct 28 at 11:11
#34
Bahston Brewins
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 748
Likes: 207
I think it's still unfair to call Kase overrated for the Bruins. I don't really know who else to call overrated on the Bruins though...Nick Ritchie? I would say Nick Ritchie is the most overrated, but he's not expected to do much already. I just wanna see a full season of Kase and Ritchie before I trash them.
Oct 28 at 11:12
#35
Watches no games
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 763
Quoting: jslongo
Agreed here. How can you say a guy who led the league by more than 10 points, isnt top 15 at his position?


If your opponents score more on you than you on them, when you are on the ice, thats a net negative. The best players are the players with the highest ratio of their team scoring compared to the opposing team scoring, not the players with the highest counting stats.

But yeah, he's still top 15.
Oct 28 at 11:13
#36
Watches no games
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 763
Quoting: nalzugaray12
I think it's still unfair to call Kase overrated for the Bruins. I don't really know who else to call overrated on the Bruins though...Nick Ritchie? I would say Nick Ritchie is the most overrated, but he's not expected to do much already. I just wanna see a full season of Kase and Ritchie before I trash them.


Brandon Carlo
Oct 28 at 11:15
#37
Bahston Brewins
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 748
Likes: 207
Quoting: MelonVK
Brandon Carlo


I can definitely say it's not Brandon Carlo. I would call Zdeno Chara overrated before I call Carlo overrated
Oct 28 at 11:15
#38
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 792
Likes: 261
Quoting: Saskleaf
Holl isn’t overrated. People act like he’s a 3rd pairing guy.


Well he is. He would be a 6th/7th defensemen on any other contending team
Oct 28 at 11:17
#39
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 1,929
Likes: 720
100% holl for the leafs
Oct 28 at 11:18
#40
Watches no games
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 763
Quoting: nalzugaray12
I can definitely say it's not Brandon Carlo.


People think he's some kind of shutdown master, when in reality he's pretty good defensively but garbage offensively. Krug's way better att offense than Carlo is at defense. Krug's way better at defense than Carlo is at offense. But people in Boston still act like Carlo is some untouchable asset.
Oct 28 at 11:18
#41
Nick Suzuki the GOAT
Joined: Oct 2020
Posts: 837
Likes: 536
Dumba, Makar, Connor, Kubalik, Barkov aren’t overrated
Oct 28 at 11:19
#42
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 1,929
Likes: 720
Quoting: A_Habs_fan
Dumba, Makar, Connor, Kubalik, Barkov aren’t overrated


connor and dumba are
Oct 28 at 11:20
#43
KwawiisdaGOAT
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 3,995
Likes: 1,493
Quoting: TheLeafsSeason
Well he is. He would be a 6th/7th defensemen on any other contending team


Not really. He's been great playing beside Muzzin on the second pairing. I get playing with Muzzin obvoiusly helps, but he was good on the second pairing. What does this mean? Second pairing defenceman.
Oct 28 at 11:20
#44
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 1,929
Likes: 720
Quoting: MelonVK
People think he's some kind of shutdown master, when in reality he's pretty good defensively but garbage offensively. Krug's way better att offense than Carlo is at defense. Krug's way better at defense than Carlo is at offense. But people in Boston still act like Carlo is some untouchable asset.


krug is a glorified pp specialist
Oct 28 at 11:20
#45
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 1,929
Likes: 720
Quoting: Saskleaf
Not really. He's been great playing beside Muzzin on the second pairing. I get playing with Muzzin obvoiusly helps, but he was good on the second pairing. What does this mean? Second pairing defenceman.


ryan graves plays 1st line minutes with makar, is he a top pairing d? no way
Oct 28 at 11:22
#46
Watches no games
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 763
Quoting: vr1995
krug is a glorified pp specialist


Oh, so you're exactly the person I'm talking about? Carlo is a glorified, defensively solid player. Both Kurg and Carlo are specialists. Krug is way more effective at his speciality than Carlo is.
Saskleaf liked this.
Oct 28 at 11:23
#47
KwawiisdaGOAT
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 3,995
Likes: 1,493
Quoting: vr1995
ryan graves plays 1st line minutes with makar, is he a top pairing d? no way


Yes he is. He's obvoiusly helped a lot by Makar, but if he plays on a successful first pairing, he's a 1st pairing defenceman.
Oct 28 at 11:24
#48
Bahston Brewins
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 748
Likes: 207
Quoting: MelonVK
People think he's some kind of shutdown master, when in reality he's pretty good defensively but garbage offensively. Krug's way better att offense than Carlo is at defense. Krug's way better at defense than Carlo is at offense. But people in Boston still act like Carlo is some untouchable asset.


Just because he isn't good offensively doesn't make him overrated. His job out there is to shut the opponent down and he's excellent at it. Brandon Carlo IS practically untouchable unless an offer would blow the Bruins away. A 23 year old 6'5 shutdown dman who has been reliable in the top 4 since he was 19 years old is a pretty big asset. When you have McAvoy and Carlo on the right side, it's pretty hard to split that up.

Krug's job out there is to provide more offense. You are blinded from Krug's offensive output compared to Carlo's defensive output. Who's to say Krug's offense is better than Carlo's defense? It is an extremely close debate.
Oct 28 at 11:26
#49
Oil Country Rising
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 347
Likes: 140
Hah. Draisaitl not being a top 15 CENTER (not even player, but CENTER? Bold move Cotton).
That argument got shot down by the players HARD when they voted for him to win the Ted Lindsay.

Actual NHL Players > Keyboard GMs

Thanks for playing, though.
Oct 28 at 11:27
#50
Watches no games
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,589
Likes: 763
Quoting: nalzugaray12
Just because he isn't good offensively doesn't make him overrated. His job out there is to shut the opponent down and he's excellent at it. Brandon Carlo IS practically untouchable unless an offer would blow the Bruins away. A 23 year old 6'5 shutdown dman who has been reliable in the top 4 since he was 19 years old is a pretty big asset. When you have McAvoy and Carlo on the right side, it's pretty hard to split that up.


Carlo was very bad when he first entered the league. He's gradually become defensively solid, but he was very much a net negative player his first year.

It's just funny how you don't see how you're justifying Carlo's speciality but knocking Krug for his. It's fine to have specialists, I agree, but it's all imagination if you think Carlo is better than Krug overall.

The fact that you mention his height should be enough to tell you where your bias lies, really.

The Krug-Carlo pairing was effective, but it'll be interesting to see what happens when Carlo no longer can rely on his partner to always get the puck out of his own zone.
 
Reply
To create a post please Login or Register
Question:
Options:
Add Option
Remove Option
Submit Poll