Dont just post Decline or Accept lets here your opinions

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Created by: Reason

Team: 2021-22 Vancouver Canucks

Initial Creation Date: Aug. 15, 2021

Published: Aug. 15, 2021

Salary Cap Mode: Basic

Description

First off, I am a big fan of QH, I think he has the potential to become Vancouver's first ever franchise defenseman, however I figured I would see what Vancouver *could* look like if the team decided to take a different approach and move QH.

Trade breakdowns:

QH to NJ : Most Canuck fans are saying it would take Smith, Holtz and a 1st, NJ fans disagree saying the cost should be less. Here I take out Holtz and replace him with a lesser prospect in Foote to try and "balance" the trade out.

NASH trade: VAN could use both improvement and youth on their right side, Fabbro meets those needs both in the short and long term. NASH appears to be starting a rebuild, here they collect 2nd and 3rd round picks in what are supposed to be very deep drafts, they also get a young LD who didn't look out of place in his limited action last season. With Ekholm likely leaving at some point during the season, there should be some space on the left side.

By making the trades Vancouver's top 4 looks fairly good in the next few seasons. Top 4 could included: Ekman-Larrson, Smith, Rathbone, Fabbro and or one of their 1st rounders next season. The trades also provide some additional cap space (assuming Hughes gets 7+ million) and allow EP40 to be signed for 8 years.

Free Agent Signings

RFA		YEARS	CAP HIT
Pettersson, Elias		8	$9,500,000

UFA		YEARS	CAP HIT
Cizikas, Casey		1	$2,250,000

Trades

VAN

Foote, Nolan
Smith, Ty
2022 1st round pick (NJD)

NJD

Hughes, Quinn [RFA Rights]

VAN

Fabbro, Dante

NSH

Juolevi, Olli
2022 3rd round pick (WPG)
2023 2nd round pick (VAN)

Buyouts

Braden Holtby: $500,000
Jake Virtanen: $50,000

Recapture Fees

Roberto Luongo: $3,035,212

Draft	Round 1	Round 2	Round 3	Round 4	Round 5	Round 6	Round 7
2022
2023
2024

ROSTER

LONG-TERM OUTLOOK

EMBED

TEXT-EMBED

ROSTER SIZE	SALARY CAP	CAP HIT	OVERAGES	BONUSES	CAP SPACE
24	$81,500,000	$81,587,325	$648,780	$3,800,000	-$87,325

Left Wing	Centre	Right Wing
Miller, J.T. $5,250,000$5,250,000 C, LW, RW UFA - 2	Pettersson, Elias $9,500,000$9,500,000 C, LW UFA - 3	Boeser, Brock $5,875,000$5,875,000 RW UFA - 1
Höglander, Nils $891,667$891,667 ($200,000$200K) LW, RW RFA - 2	Horvat, Bo $4,125,000$4,125,000 C UFA - 2	Garland, Conor $4,950,000$4,950,000 RW, LW UFA - 5
Pearson, Tanner $3,250,000$3,250,000 LW NTC UFA - 3	Dickinson, Jason $2,650,000$2,650,000 C, LW UFA - 3	Podkolzin, Vasily $925,000$925,000 ($850,000$850K) RW, LW RFA - 3
Motte, Tyler $1,225,000$1,225,000 LW, RW UFA - 1		Sutter, Brandon $1,125,000$1,125,000 RW, C UFA - 1
	Cizikas, Casey $2,250,000$2,250,000 C UFA - 6

Left Defense	Right Defense	Goaltender
Ekman-Larsson, Oliver $7,260,000$7,260,000 LD NMC UFA - 6	Hamonic, Travis $3,000,000$3,000,000 RD M-NTC UFA - 2	Demko, Thatcher $5,000,000$5,000,000 G UFA - 5
Smith, Ty $863,333$863,333 ($400,000$400K) LD/RD RFA - 2	Fabbro, Dante $2,400,000$2,400,000 RD UFA - 2	Halák, Jaroslav $1,500,000$1,500,000 ($1,500,000$2M) G NMC UFA - 1
Rathbone, Jack $925,000$925,000 ($850,000$850K) LD UFA - 1	Myers, Tyler $6,000,000$6,000,000 RD NTC UFA - 3

Scratches	Injured Reserve (IR)	Long Term IR (LTIR)
Highmore, Matthew $725,000$725,000 LW, RW UFA - 1	Ferland, Micheal $3,500,000$3,500,000 LW, RW M-NTC UFA - 2
Foote, Nolan $863,333$863,333 LW RFA - 3
Poolman, Tucker $2,500,000$2,500,000 RD UFA - 4
Hunt, Brad $800,000$800,000 LD/RD UFA - 1

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:09 p.m.

SamTheGoalie

Saturdays Ferda Boys

Joined: Feb. 2021

Posts: 560

Likes: 70

No they shouldn't consider it. EVER.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:11 p.m.

Reason

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2020

Posts: 1,576

Likes: 732

Quoting: SamTheGoalie

No they shouldn't consider it. EVER.

How about providing a reason. Not saying I disagree with you, but lets add something to be contemplated or possibly discussed. Is the value off? Is he essential to the long term success? etc...

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:15 p.m.

TheAlien

Joined: Apr. 2019

Posts: 7,894

Likes: 6,396

Make it Holtz instead of Foote. You also can't make Poolman a scratch

Kotkaniemi15 liked this.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:17 p.m.

Boltsbeathabs

Joined: Jul. 2021

Posts: 6,734

Likes: 2,538

Hughes isn't Foote and a first better than Smith.

Devil, Tintin and zyyyp liked this.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:20 p.m.

TheFastAndTheFleuryous

GO KNIGHTS GO

Joined: Jul. 2021

Posts: 2,645

Likes: 2,273

As a Preds fan, I can't speak to NJ's side of the deal. However, having watched Dante for a while now, I think he's a weak defenseman and I think Nashville says yes here if this trade came up even though they just re-signed him.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:22 p.m.

Reason

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2020

Posts: 1,576

Likes: 732

Quoting: TheAlien

Make it Holtz instead of Foote. You also can't make Poolman a scratch

Quoting: Boltsbeathabs

Hughes isn't Foote and a first better than Smith.

This is why I proposed it. Seems the different fan bases have very different ideas as to the value of their players, as a result I tried to shrink the gap.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:24 p.m.

Boltsbeathabs

Joined: Jul. 2021

Posts: 6,734

Likes: 2,538

Quoting: Reason

This is why I proposed it. Seems the different fan bases have very different ideas as to the value of their players, as a result I tried to shrink the gap.

Just offered my completely unbiased opinion

Reason and Devil liked this.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:25 p.m.

TheAlien

Joined: Apr. 2019

Posts: 7,894

Likes: 6,396

Quoting: Reason

This is why I proposed it. Seems the different fan bases have very different ideas as to the value of their players, as a result I tried to shrink the gap.

Canucks are under no obligation to make a trade. That's the price, if they don't like it so be it we'll keep Hughes

yeboi6 liked this.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:26 p.m.

Boltsbeathabs

Joined: Jul. 2021

Posts: 6,734

Likes: 2,538

Quoting: TheAlien

Canucks are under no obligation to make a trade. That's the price, if they don't like it so be it we'll keep Hughes

New Jersey would probably be smart to let Vancouver

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:35 p.m.

#10

Reason

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2020

Posts: 1,576

Likes: 732

Quoting: TheAlien

Canucks are under no obligation to make a trade. That's the price, if they don't like it so be it we'll keep Hughes

Neither team is obligated to make the trade.
Not saying I want or would trade QH, the kids a stud, however I think if Vancouver can net:

- Future top pairing D that can play either side,
- Future middle six goal scoring forward
- First round pick in a deep draft
- Add cap flexibility to sign EP40 to a long term contract that will provide significant value down the road
- Add additional cap flexibility

Then it's at least worth considering. If NJ wanted to swap Holtz for Foote it would be a no brainer, but no brainer trades don't happen very frequently.

Faulk_my_Dzingel and MellowK liked this.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:35 p.m.

#11

NJDevils1317

Joined: Aug. 2021

Posts: 4,460

Likes: 2,282

The Devils shouldn't be paying up to get Quinn. It's not like getting Quinn keeps Jack. Smith is good, the Devils should spend assets just getting a brother.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:35 p.m.

#12

ricochetii

Go Habs Go

Joined: Mar. 2017

Posts: 10,667

Likes: 4,091

Quoting: Boltsbeathabs

Hughes isn't Foote and a first better than Smith.

Nope. They are both 5'10".

IF this trade were to happen, it's because NJ wants it, not Vancouver, and it's going to take a premium.
It might not cost quite that much, but it's probably at least in the ballpark.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:39 p.m.

#13

Reason

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2020

Posts: 1,576

Likes: 732

Quoting: JeffSkinnerFan53

It's refreshing to hear a fan give a critical opinion of one of their players, doesn't happen often.
I originally had Juolevi a 2nd and 4th for Fabbro but I could see NASH fans typing "Decline!".

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:43 p.m.

#14

Reason

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2020

Posts: 1,576

Likes: 732

Quoting: ricochetii

I think this is a very fair comment, and goes with what I was trying to do here. It would be NJ that would want this trade to happen and therefore I think it would cost more than most NJ fans are speculating, however I also don't think the price would be as high as many Vancouver fans are speculating. Smith, Holtz and a 1st is unrealistic optimism in my opinion, sure Vancouver doesn't have to make the trade but if it were to happen it wouldn't be for that package.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:45 p.m.

#15

TheAlien

Joined: Apr. 2019

Posts: 7,894

Likes: 6,396

Quoting: Reason

Canucks aren't negotiating. It's Smith, Holtz, and a 1st that's it. The only way they trade Hughes is if it's a no brainer anything less and they don't consider it

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:47 p.m.

#16

Reason

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2020

Posts: 1,576

Likes: 732

Quoting: TheAlien

Canucks aren't negotiating. It's Smith, Holtz, and a 1st that's it. The only way they trade Hughes is if it's a no brainer anything less and they don't consider it

I think you mean "TheAlien is not negotiating", as usual.

zyyyp liked this.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:49 p.m.

#17

gmgb

Joined: Jun. 2017

Posts: 7,667

Likes: 5,252

Quoting: Reason

It's refreshing to hear a fan give a critical opinion of one of their players, doesn't happen often.
I originally had Juolevi a 2nd and 4th for Fabbro but I could see NASH fans typing "Decline!".

Even with the current proposal, I've got no interest in it for the Preds. Sure, Fabbro has had his growing pains, and may top out as just a #4 dman. I'm not nearly as optimistic about Juolevi though. I don't think he makes it at the NHL level. His age and left handedness work against him too, from the Preds' perspective. With NSH looking to re-sign Ekholm, and Josi having lots of term left, the Preds don't have many openings on the left side for the foreseeable future. Davies and Farrance would have the inside track for that last roster spot over Juolevi.

ZPirtle liked this.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:49 p.m.

#18

TheAlien

Joined: Apr. 2019

Posts: 7,894

Likes: 6,396

Quoting: Reason

I think you mean "TheAlien is not negotiating", as usual.

It doesn't take a genius to know that it's gonna take a massive overpayment for the Canucks to move Hughes. These are just facts

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:49 p.m.

#19

mokumboi

Joined: Apr. 2019

Posts: 29,415

Likes: 11,389

Quoting: Reason

It's refreshing to hear a fan give a critical opinion of one of their players, doesn't happen often.
I originally had Juolevi a 2nd and 4th for Fabbro but I could see NASH fans typing "Decline!".

He's not a Preds fan. And his opinion is pretty kooky. I cannot see a single reason that Nashville would do that. Fabbro's fine play is one reason they felt okay dealing Ellis, and Juolevi is quickly headed toward bust status.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:55 p.m.

#20

Reason

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2020

Posts: 1,576

Likes: 732

Quoting: TheAlien

It doesn't take a genius to know that it's gonna take a massive overpayment for the Canucks to move Hughes. These are just facts

Pretty sure lots of NJ fans would call the proposed trade an overpayment, but hey I guess only a genius would know so Ill have to take your word for it.

zyyyp liked this.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:57 p.m.

#21

TheAlien

Joined: Apr. 2019

Posts: 7,894

Likes: 6,396

Quoting: Reason

Pretty sure lots of NJ fans would call the proposed trade an overpayment, but hey I guess only a genius would know so Ill have to take your word for it.

Devils fans would think Hughes for Smith straight up would be an overpayment

Aug. 15, 2021 at 5:57 p.m.

#22

Faulk_my_Dzingel

Smythe.over.Hart

Joined: Jul. 2019

Posts: 3,035

Likes: 2,350

The trading of Hughes for Vancouver depends on what strategy Van is going with. Are they in win now mode? Win 2 years from now. Or rebuilding? Benning has to pick a path and stick to it.

All I’ve seen from him so far is contending for middle of the pack.

New Jersey is in contending 2-3 years now mode. So acquiring Hughes is ok. But the amount to give up is the limiter.

Reason liked this.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 6:12 p.m.

#23

TrueCanuck

Roster Architect

Joined: Mar. 2021

Posts: 2,643

Likes: 909

Quoting: TheAlien

Make it Holtz instead of Foote. You also can't make Poolman a scratch

Canucks fans need to wake up and see what reality is in front of them instead of just what's in their dreams:

Yea moving Hughes would take a lot. But when you look at the proposed deal, it's actually fairly solid. Canucks are essentially switching Hughes for Ty Smith. And yes Hughes is better, but the value difference is nowhere near Alex Holtz + 1st round pick, even having Foote in there is a little high but still on the possibility.

The prosper deal is a slight overpay by New Jersey. So in terms of value, it's acceptable (whether Canucks fans can admit it or not) - the likelihood of the trade is where the debate comes in. Fans on here wanna take sides based on who their favourite team is and they never wanna give up their best players unless it's a massive overpay (like you saying Hughes for Smith + Holtz + 1st round pick would be), but that's not the way to look at it. Maybe Hughes wants to play with his brothers, making a trade more likely and it actually drives the value of the return down for Vancouver because they have 1 team to talk to that can fulfill that trade.

But in terms of value, the proposed deal is definitely in the right area.

Devil and Reason liked this.

Aug. 15, 2021 at 6:15 p.m.

#24

Devil

Speak of the Devil

Joined: Nov. 2017

Posts: 23,938

Likes: 26,436

Quoting: Boltsbeathabs

Hughes isn't Foote and a first better than Smith.

Quoting: TrueCanuck

Aug. 15, 2021 at 6:17 p.m.

#25

Reason

Thread Starter

Joined: Jul. 2020

Posts: 1,576

Likes: 732

Edited Aug. 15, 2021 at 6:25 p.m.

Quoting: gmgb

I don't think many project Juolevi as a top 4 anymore, I think he's more likely to end up as a bottom pair or 7th D which is why the 2 & 3rd are there.
I see/read a fair amount of different assessments on Fabbro, some are higher on him than others. I have seen some AGM's that propose Fabbro for a 2nd and others for a 1st that get a mixed responses, I usually think the cost is somewhere in the middle.

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