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2021-2022 NHL Offseason Discussion Thread #8 - Gone Fishing

Jul. 21, 2022 at 7:19 a.m.
#1176
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Where not the only ones making fun of these AGMs
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 9:57 a.m.
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A lot of Barzal slander out there, going as far as saying he’s a 2C on a bad team, 3C on a contender.

Among all NHL forwards last season, Barzal ranked in the 300’s in on ice shooting % despite well above average playmaking and elite transition play. Do you know how bad your linemates have to be for that to be the case?

If you gave him average middle 6 wingers with a decent shot, he’d likely finish with 7-10 more points last season.
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 10:05 a.m.
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Quoting: Db1899
A lot of Barzal slander out there, going as far as saying he’s a 2C on a bad team, 3C on a contender.

Among all NHL forwards last season, Barzal ranked in the 300’s in on ice shooting % despite well above average playmaking and elite transition play. Do you know how bad your linemates have to be for that to be the case?

If you gave him average middle 6 wingers with a decent shot, he’d likely finish with 7-10 more points last season.

True, Barzal is a 3C and Dobson is a 2RD. If you add two 1sts you might get Tkachuk tbh
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 10:19 a.m.
#1179
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Quoting: Db1899
A lot of Barzal slander out there, going as far as saying he’s a 2C on a bad team, 3C on a contender.

Among all NHL forwards last season, Barzal ranked in the 300’s in on ice shooting % despite well above average playmaking and elite transition play. Do you know how bad your linemates have to be for that to be the case?

If you gave him average middle 6 wingers with a decent shot, he’d likely finish with 7-10 more points last season.


Going back and looking at Barzals stats, i forgot how insane his rookie season was.
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 10:21 a.m.
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Quoting: BuFfaLOFaN
Going back and looking at Barzals stats, i forgot how insane his rookie season was.


He played most of the season with Beauvillier and Eberle. That line was so much fun to watch. Once Trotz became head coach he never put those 3 together
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 10:28 a.m.
#1181
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Quoting: Db1899
A lot of Barzal slander out there, going as far as saying he’s a 2C on a bad team, 3C on a contender.

Among all NHL forwards last season, Barzal ranked in the 300’s in on ice shooting % despite well above average playmaking and elite transition play. Do you know how bad your linemates have to be for that to be the case?

If you gave him average middle 6 wingers with a decent shot, he’d likely finish with 7-10 more points last season.


i think somewhere around half the teams in the league might have barzal as a 2c and maybe only 1 or 2 teams hed be a 3c.
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 10:32 a.m.
#1182
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Quoting: BuFfaLOFaN




Where not the only ones making fun of these AGMs


my mission is for one of my trades to end up on this account
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 10:41 a.m.
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Quoting: DirtyDangle
i think somewhere around half the teams in the league might have barzal as a 2c and maybe only 1 or 2 teams hed be a 3c.

What teams would he be a 3C on? I can think of 4 teams with 2 elite centres, but I would slide one of those 2 to the wing before Barzal in each case (Draisaitl, Malkin, Tavares, Stamkos). I probably like him more than Tavares and maybe Malkin as well straight up.
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:01 a.m.
#1184
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Quoting: Alfie11
What teams would he be a 3C on? I can think of 4 teams with 2 elite centres, but I would slide one of those 2 to the wing before Barzal in each case (Draisaitl, Malkin, Tavares, Stamkos). I probably like him more than Tavares and maybe Malkin as well straight up.


well if you move someone to the wing then no team
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:02 a.m.
#1185
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Steal
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:05 a.m.
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How did Nino not get more than that?? He’s a great player
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:07 a.m.
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Quoting: Alfie11
What teams would he be a 3C on? I can think of 4 teams with 2 elite centres, but I would slide one of those 2 to the wing before Barzal in each case (Draisaitl, Malkin, Tavares, Stamkos). I probably like him more than Tavares and maybe Malkin as well straight up.


Quoting: Db1899
He played most of the season with Beauvillier and Eberle. That line was so much fun to watch. Once Trotz became head coach he never put those 3 together


Quoting: DirtyDangle
i think somewhere around half the teams in the league might have barzal as a 2c and maybe only 1 or 2 teams hed be a 3c.


Before reading below, remember I think this is completely Trotz fault and can not wait until next year under a different coach. I think that Trotz's style does not at all benefit a player like Barzal and i am glad he is free of Trotz.

I think Barzal really has declined significantly with Trotz on the team, he really hasn't been the player we thought he would be since his rookie year. He has a 75% OZ start percentage and he was a -15, plus minus isn't a great stat I agree but just was trying to play devils advocate. He also really didn't do well when paired with Anders Lee who is a great player in my opinion, and that was his most common linemate. Here is Barzals even strenght lines form last season, most common. There is an argument to be made that players where worse with Barzal than better with him, take the Parise - Barzal - Wahlstrom line, they played a lot together and where not overly spectacular, the Parise - Wahlstrom combo was arguably better with JGP. Anders Lee though was a lot better with Barzal and Bailey than he was with Nelson and Beauvillier even strength.

259:23 - Bailey - Lee - Barzal
165:08 - Parise - Barzal - Wahlstrom
103:03 - Parise - Barzal - Palmier
78:13 - Palmieri - Lee - Barzal
52:01 Parise - Barzal - Bellows.
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:11 a.m.
#1188
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Dorion should be spam calling Treliving rn for Tanev . Don’t hang uppppppp
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:14 a.m.
#1189
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Quoting: BuFfaLOFaN
Before reading below, remember I think this is completely Trotz fault and can not wait until next year under a different coach. I think that Trotz's style does not at all benefit a player like Barzal and i am glad he is free of Trotz.

I think Barzal really has declined significantly with Trotz on the team, he really hasn't been the player we thought he would be since his rookie year. He has a 75% OZ start percentage and he was a -15, plus minus isn't a great stat I agree but just was trying to play devils advocate. He also really didn't do well when paired with Anders Lee who is a great player in my opinion, and that was his most common linemate. Here is Barzals even strenght lines form last season, most common. There is an argument to be made that players where worse with Barzal than better with him, take the Parise - Barzal - Wahlstrom line, they played a lot together and where not overly spectacular, the Parise - Wahlstrom combo was arguably better with JGP. Anders Lee though was a lot better with Barzal and Bailey than he was with Nelson and Beauvillier even strength.

259:23 - Bailey - Lee - Barzal
165:08 - Parise - Barzal - Wahlstrom
103:03 - Parise - Barzal - Palmier
78:13 - Palmieri - Lee - Barzal
52:01 Parise - Barzal - Bellows.


Barzals best season of his career was the 20-21 season. Barzal and Eberle had great chemistry , they tortured defenses by consistently maintaining possession in the ozone.

The problem with Barzal last season is Trotz put players who were struggling on Barzals line. When Bailey went 10 games without a point, he got moved up with Barzal. Same with Palmieri and Parise.

I believe at least 75-85 min of the Parise-Barzal-Wahlstrom line was accumulated by playing at the end of games together down a goal. That line was only together for like 12 actual games. They did the best in terms of driving play offensively, but they weren’t scoring
Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:16 a.m.
#1190
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Lou lamoriello is a criminal
Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:17 a.m.
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Quoting: SevenLeg




Steal

Actually can’t believe Calgary didn’t sign him, he seems like the perfect Sutter guy. Especially for a massive underpay with no term like that. He’d probably be worth 5mil for 3-5 years.
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:18 a.m.
#1192
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Quoting: SevenLeg




Steal


So true, hate that the Leafs couldn’t make that work. Such a good player in both ends of the ice

FYMwlrJWQAAUr8N?format=jpg&name=large

Great pickup for NSH
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:21 a.m.
#1193
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Quoting: Alfie11
Actually can’t believe Calgary didn’t sign him, he seems like the perfect Sutter guy. Especially for a massive underpay with no term like that. He’d probably be worth 5mil for 3-5 years.


Quoting: MatthewsFan
So true, hate that the Leafs couldn’t make that work. Such a good player in both ends of the ice

FYMwlrJWQAAUr8N?format=jpg&name=large

Great pickup for NSH


Hurricanes also tried to bring him back and they had the "home advantage" + over $4M in cap space. I'm surprised they couldn't make this work. He probably didn't want to play with Kotkaniemi.
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:23 a.m.
#1194
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Quoting: SevenLeg
Hurricanes also tried to bring him back and they had the "home advantage" + over $4M in cap space. I'm surprised they couldn't make this work. He probably didn't want to play with Kotkaniemi.


His lack of playoff production is concerning but at this AAV and term, great win for NSH
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:25 a.m.
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Quoting: MatthewsFan
His lack of playoff production is concerning but at this AAV and term, great win for NSH


He still works very hard, was very noticeable even though he might not have put up major points. Especially in critical games.
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:43 a.m.
#1196
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Quoting: MatthewsFan
His lack of playoff production is concerning but at this AAV and term, great win for NSH


probably why the leafs weren't in on him, honestly.

if he provided the production he gave minnesota and carolina after 2016 in the playoffs, he'd be on every acgm out of toronto. kerfoot is slightly better in the post season and a lot of leafs fans are giddy to send him to arizona for a seventh.
Jul. 21, 2022 at 11:50 a.m.
#1197
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Quoting: mondo
probably why the leafs weren't in on him, honestly.

if he provided the production he gave minnesota and carolina after 2016 in the playoffs, he'd be on every acgm out of toronto. kerfoot is slightly better in the post season and a lot of leafs fans are giddy to send him to arizona for a seventh.


I can't see the Leafs making any moves till the Sandin situation is taking of (sign or trade) IMO they just ran out of time.

Nino would have been the PERFECT fit beside Nylander and Tavares.

I can't believe Kerfoot and Holl are still on this roster. Something has to give here
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 12:02 p.m.
#1198
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Top 10 Top 6's. Feel like Colorado, Toronto, Tampa and Edmonton's top end skill player can carry there first 2 lines.

Top 10 is not In order.

MacKinnon, Rantenen, Landeskog, Nichushkin, Newhook, Lehkonen. If Kadri comes back it's better
Kucherov, Point, Stamkos, Cirelli, Paul, Killorn
Barkov, Reinhart, Huberdeau, Lundell, Bennett, Duclair
Matthews, Marner, Tavares, Nylander, Bunting, (idk)
O'Reilly, Tarasenko, Buchnevich, Kyrou, Thomas, Schenn
Aho, Svechnikov, Jarvis, Teräväinen, Pacioretty, Necas
Connor, Scheifele, Ehlers, Dubois, Wheeler, Perfetti
McDavid, Draisaitl, Kane, Nuge, Hyman, Puljujarvi
Panarin, Zibanajed, Kreider, Trochek, Lafrenière, Kakko?
Giroux, Batherson, Debrincat, Norris, Stutzle, Tkachuk

HM
Ovi, Kuznetsov, Backstrom, Oshie, Wilson, Mantha
PIT, DAL, CBJ, DET, VAN

Long Shots but development could get them there.
BUF, NJ.
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 12:03 p.m.
#1199
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Quoting: BuFfaLOFaN
Top 10 Top 6's. Feel like Colorado, Toronto, Tampa and Edmonton's top end skill player can carry there first 2 lines.

Top 10 is not In order.

MacKinnon, Rantenen, Landeskog, Nichushkin, Newhook, Lehkonen. If Kadri comes back it's better
Kucherov, Point, Stamkos, Cirelli, Paul, Killorn
Barkov, Reinhart, Huberdeau, Lundell, Bennett, Duclair
Matthews, Marner, Tavares, Nylander, Bunting, (idk)
O'Reilly, Tarasenko, Buchnevich, Kyrou, Thomas, Schenn
Aho, Svechnikov, Jarvis, Teräväinen, Pacioretty, Necas
Connor, Scheifele, Ehlers, Dubois, Wheeler, Perfetti
McDavid, Draisaitl, Kane, Nuge, Hyman, Puljujarvi
Panarin, Zibanajed, Kreider, Trochek, Lafrenière, Kakko?
Giroux, Batherson, Debrincat, Norris, Stutzle, Tkachuk

HM
Ovi, Kuznetsov, Backstrom, Oshie, Wilson, Mantha
PIT, DAL, CBJ, DET, VAN

Long Shots but development could get them there.
BUF, NJ.


I know this is probably based on numbers from last season but it might change quite a bit this year. Age group matters. Some of them reached their peak, some of them are gonna decline and some are about to breakout . So we can have a totally different list by seasons end
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Jul. 21, 2022 at 12:08 p.m.
#1200
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Quoting: csick
I know this is probably based on numbers from last season but it might change quite a bit this year. Age group matters. Some of them reached their peak, some of them are gonna decline and some are about to breakout . So we can have a totally different list by seasons end


No, this was just completely based on my gut feeling lmao. I just looked at the teams and selected the ones I thought where going to be fun.
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