Most overrated players in the league

Forums/Armchair-GM

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Created by: deys3232

Team: 2020-21 Custom Team

Initial Creation Date: Oct. 30, 2020

Published: Nov. 2, 2020

Salary Cap Mode: Basic

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Anaheim-Manson. Hes not a top pair defenseman, hes nowhere near William Nylander. Stop making those trades
Arizona-Keller. Hes a 3rd liner whos getting points because hes in a top 6 role. hes not good
Boston-Bergeron I went with Bergeron because many people still think he is a top 5/top 10 centre. Hes no longer a selke level player either. Hes good overall, but no longer a top 10/Selke level player
Buffalo-Ristolainen. He just sucks, hes below replacement level. Buffalo force feeding him the puck and Jack Eichel are the only reason he is still in the NHL.
Calgary-Monahan people think this guy is a top line centre. Hes not. He got carried by Gaudreau for the longest time, and he "surprisingly" had a down year the same year that Gaudreau did. hes a below average 2nd line centre. It also doesnt help that he sucks defensively
Carolina-
Chicago-Kane. People think he is still a top 5 winger. Some even think hes the best winger. Hes not. Hes around like 15th for me. His value has plummeted after his offensive game has kinda dropped off (no, I dont mean points, I mean overall offense. Point =/= Offense)
Colorado-A lot of people are saying that he is a top 10 or even top 5 defensive defenseman after he just led the league in +/-. +/- is one of if not the worst stat in hockey. You could be the best player in the league but if you are stuck on a trash team that gets outscored 5-1 every game, you will have a horrible +/-.
Columbus-Jones. Seth Jones is the most overrated player in the league in my opinion. He looks like he knows what he is doing. Many people think he is a top 10 defenseman. When he isnt even top 30. He hovers around league average when you look at his actual impact
Dallas-Lindell. He sucks. People think he is a good defenseman because he blocks shots. When in fact hes always stuck in his own zone
Detroit-Bertuzzi This one was kinda hard. The redwinsg suck so there isnt really much overrating going on. But If you think Bertuzzi is an allstar, then you would be overrating him. Hes a decent 2nd liner on most teams
Edmonton-Nurse. Most of the Oilers are overrated tbh, I just picked Nurse because people think hes good and should be on team Canada. Hes not good. His defense sucks.
Florida-Yandle. Yandle has become a PP specialist now. He was Elite in Arizona. But in Florida, hes been garbage 5v5. The only think keeping him in the league is Florida's power play and his name
LA-Doughty. He sucks. He was below replacement leve this year. Hes got the worst contract in the NHL
Minnesota- Suter & Dumba. This one was a tie. Many people think these two are the two best defensemen on Minnesota, when Spurgeon and Brodin are miles ahead of them
Habs-Price. People think he is a top 3 goalie in the league. Yes, he has been overworked for the last couple years, but so have Hellebuyck and Andersen. I dont see any excuses for them
Nashville-Johnansen. Hes not a top 6 centre. Hes a 3rd liner. His contract sucks
New Jersey- Wood. Hes just garbage. Barely an NHLer. Worst defensive forward in the NHL
Islanders-Pelech Isles fans seem to think that Pelech is the next coming of Lidstrom when hes a slightly above average defenseman. Hes not even elite defensively
Rangers-Trouba. He was garbage this year. Not a top 4 defenseman, but hes paid like a superstar
Senators-Galchenyuk. Hes just bad. He was a highly touted prospect. hes been bad his entire career. hes nothing more than a 4th liner
Flyers-Provorov. He was slightly above average 5v5 this year. Got super lucky on the powerplay Hes not a top pairing defenseman
Penguins- Kapanen. Hes a 3rd liner with speed. Thats about it. Hes got horrible decison making and isnt a good PKer like Leafs fans say he is
Sharks-Couture. hes a decent 2nd line centre. Not sure why people think he should make Team Canada. If you dont think hes a top line centre, you wont be overrating him. Nobody on the Sharks is overrated imo
Blues-Binnington. hes not really overrated much. Some think hes trash, others think hes elite. Hes in the middle imo
Lightning-Vasy. Easily. People think hes the best goalie in the league. He is a good goalie who benefits from playing behind a stacked defense
Leafs-Simmonds. I think its hard for a Leaf to be overrated since everyone hates them. But Simmonds was not an NHL calibre player last year. He sucked.
Canucks-Pearson. He would be a 4th liner on most teams, not sure why we have him on the 2nd line. Hes not very good
Knights-Fleury. Hes an average backup. Seems like a great dude. But hes not a HOFer
Capitals-Kuznetsov. I couldve given this to Ovi, or Carlson. All 3 are massively overrated. Kuznetsov sucks. Hes horrible defensively, doesnt generate anything. Pure finsher. Had a great cup run. But hes regressed since then
Jets-Connor. hes sort of a meme in the analytics community. 0 WAR. He was as impactful as a 13th forward. Yes he gets goals, but his defense is so bad that it takes away all the value that his offense creates

This took me a while to make. I dont care of you hate it or love it, can you playes just leave a comment telling me what you think

ROSTER

LONG-TERM OUTLOOK

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ROSTER SIZE	SALARY CAP	CAP HIT	OVERAGES	BONUSES	CAP SPACE
31	$81,500,000	$161,597,986	$0	$0	-$80,097,986

Left Wing	Centre	Right Wing
Bertuzzi, Tyler $3,500,000$3,500,000 LW, RW UFA - 1	Monahan, Sean $6,375,000$6,375,000 C, LW, RW M-NTC UFA - 3	Keller, Clayton $7,150,000$7,150,000 LW, RW UFA - 8
Wood, Miles $2,750,000$2,750,000 LW UFA - 2	Bergeron, Patrice $6,875,000$6,875,000 C M-NTC, NMC UFA - 2	Kane, Patrick $2,625,000$2,625,000 RW NMC UFA - 3
Galchenyuk, Alex $1,050,000$1,050,000 LW, C, RW UFA - 1	Johansen, Ryan $4,000,000$4,000,000 C, RW UFA - 5	Kapanen, Kasperi $3,200,000$3,200,000 RW UFA - 2
Pearson, Tanner $3,750,000$3,750,000 LW UFA - 1	Couture, Logan $8,000,000$8,000,000 C M-NTC UFA - 7	Simmonds, Wayne $1,500,000$1,500,000 RW, LW NTC UFA - 1
Connor, Kyle $7,142,857$7,142,857 LW UFA - 6	Kuznetsov, Evgeny $3,900,000$3,900,000 C M-NTC UFA - 5

Left Defense	Right Defense	Goaltender
Manson, Josh $2,050,000$2,050,000 RD M-NTC UFA - 2		Price, Carey $10,500,000$10,500,000 G NMC UFA - 6
Ristolainen, Rasmus $5,400,000$5,400,000 RD UFA - 2		Vasilevskiy, Andrei $9,500,000$9,500,000 G UFA - 8
Skjei, Brady $5,250,000$5,250,000 LD UFA - 4		Fleury, Marc-André $3,500,000$3,500,000 G M-NTC UFA - 2
Graves, Ryan $3,166,667$3,166,667 LD UFA - 3		Binnington, Jordan $4,400,000$4,400,000 G UFA - 1
Jones, Seth $5,400,000$5,400,000 RD M-NTC UFA - 2
Lindell, Esa $5,800,000$5,800,000 LD UFA - 5
Nurse, Darnell $5,600,000$5,600,000 LD UFA - 2
Yandle, Keith $6,350,000$6,350,000 LD NMC UFA - 3
Doughty, Drew $11,000,000$11,000,000 RD NMC UFA - 7
Suter, Ryan $7,538,462$7,538,462 LD NMC UFA - 5
Pelech, Adam $1,600,000$1,600,000 LD UFA - 1
Trouba, Jacob $8,000,000$8,000,000 RD NMC UFA - 6
Provorov, Ivan $4,725,000$4,725,000 LD UFA - 5

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:28 p.m.

Stanley_Cup_To_Manhattan

Am Yisrael Chai

Joined: Oct. 2018

Posts: 18,655

Likes: 6,758

Disagree with Provorov, Pelech, Bertuzzi, and Lindell.

csick, Ajp_18 and mokumboi liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:29 p.m.

RangerWall92

Joined: Nov. 2018

Posts: 3,408

Likes: 989

Fleury is absolutely a hall of famer

LakeTrout and Pens3lieve liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:33 p.m.

lebronisdagoat

Banned

Joined: Aug. 2020

Posts: 1,180

Likes: 664

u dont watch hockey

LakeTrout, RangerWall92, csick and 6 others liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:34 p.m.

NickC1988

Chicago

Joined: Jun. 2015

Posts: 7,002

Likes: 2,852

Kane, Connor, Vase, Jones, Bertuzzi, Provorov, Graves, and Manson are not overrated. I don't understand how you evaluate these. Because AAV has a significant impact on this conversation. Manson at $4.1M is a great contract. Provorov at $6.75M is as well, especially considering they play a ton of minutes.

Ajp_18 liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:35 p.m.

Isles777

Isles7

Joined: Jun. 2019

Posts: 12,222

Likes: 5,299

Pelech is definitely overrated, but calling him a slightly above average defenseman is a stretch. Top 12 in xGA/60 over the last 3 seasons and in the 91st percentile for EV def GAR

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:36 p.m.

littlejerryseinfeld

Joined: Nov. 2017

Posts: 27,901

Likes: 14,583

I agree that Ristolainen is overrated. I have wanted to trade him for 3 years and have watched as everyone else has caught on.

But he is an NHL player.

I tend to agree that a lot of these guys are overrated. But there is a difference between overrated and bad.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:38 p.m.

LakeTrout

Joined: Nov. 2018

Posts: 192

Likes: 33

No one anywhere is saying Graves is a Top 10 defenseman you bozo

Also name your 14 wingers above Kane would love to see that

Lenny7 and Ajp_18 liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:45 p.m.

bhavikp27

Joined: Jun. 2016

Posts: 12,584

Likes: 5,455

Quoting: RangerWall92

Fleury is absolutely a hall of famer

No, he isn't. He is the most overrated G in cap era.

habslover43, deys3232 and KakkoForMauriceRichardAward liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:45 p.m.

Ledge_And_Dairy

Joined: Jun. 2019

Posts: 38,561

Likes: 19,696

Take this post with a grain of salt. This guy always posts absurd outlandish stuff like this

Ajp_18, RangerWall92 and KakkoForMauriceRichardAward liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:48 p.m.

#10

A_K

Lets Go Blues

Joined: Jun. 2016

Posts: 6,777

Likes: 4,333

I can get behind this list - most of these guys are spot on for me. I still like Provorov even though his supporting numbers don't look good - I feel like he and Seth Jones will be interesting case studies for the next few years. Right now, there is nothing to suggest that they are top pair guys other than some good fortune, but they really do look the part whenever I watch and their coaches clearly trust them with the no.1.

I've seen Couture do some remarkable things in playoff games, the 'hockey man' in me leans toward me thinking that he's a little underrated by the masses. Good 2C that you want on your side when the games get tough is probably a fair label.

deys3232 liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:48 p.m.

#11

Lenny7

Joined: Jan. 2017

Posts: 13,291

Likes: 11,051

So many un-informed spicy/salty takes here.

Ajp_18 and habslover43 liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:48 p.m.

#12

zk97

v5 CBJ GM

Joined: Feb. 2019

Posts: 15,933

Likes: 8,572

No one says that Price is a top goalie lol

Ajp_18 liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:50 p.m.

#13

mk458

MK458

Joined: Dec. 2017

Posts: 2,110

Likes: 931

I stopped reading when you said Patrick Kane is the 15th best winger in the league...

Ajp_18, habslover43 and KakkoForMauriceRichardAward liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:51 p.m.

#14

papishark

Joined: Aug. 2019

Posts: 8,796

Likes: 3,226

Hard to be overrated when you have a smaller fanbase. Guys on Toronto, Boston, New York are always more overrated

Ajp_18 and JToller1 liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:53 p.m.

#15

vr1995

Banned

Joined: Aug. 2019

Posts: 5,265

Likes: 2,154

Quoting: MaxDomi13

No one says that Price is a top goalie lol

if i need to win 1 game its carey, have to realize the team around him has been bad the last few years, he single handily won them a series against the pens

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Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:55 p.m.

#16

bhavikp27

Joined: Jun. 2016

Posts: 12,584

Likes: 5,455

Quoting: MaxDomi13

No one says that Price is a top goalie lol

Top3 he said and I have seen many comments/posts about how he's the best G/top3/top5 G in the past year(s). He isn't at the current moment. Problem is that some people are obviously biased and some know their hockey, but for whatever reason, they think he's still one of the best.

deys3232 liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 3:55 p.m.

#17

Ajp_18

Joined: Mar. 2018

Posts: 9,851

Likes: 6,441

Just so everyone is clear, this is 100% based on advanced stats and no other metric.

KakkoForMauriceRichardAward liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 4:08 p.m.

#18

Pens3lieve

Hockey IQ

Joined: May 2019

Posts: 3,024

Likes: 1,492

Quoting: lebronisdagoat

u dont watch hockey

how can you tell lol...

deys3232 liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 4:14 p.m.

#19

ON3M4N

Joined: May 2016

Posts: 11,507

Likes: 4,566

Bergeron? Really? The guy is still very much a Selke contender there are numerous metrics and the eye test backs it up. Over the last 3 years, Bergeron is playing at a rate over a point per game. In fact he's had 198pts in 190gp for a 1.04 PGP. All while still being of the top face-off guys and a Selke finalist.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 4:17 p.m.

#20

TheAlien

Joined: Apr. 2019

Posts: 7,894

Likes: 6,396

Pearson is such a weird choice. He also would've had 50+ points in a full season so not really sure how he would be a 4th liner

Nov. 2, 2020 at 4:24 p.m.

#21

Pens3lieve

Hockey IQ

Joined: May 2019

Posts: 3,024

Likes: 1,492

strongly agree with-bergeron, risto, Monahan, nurse, yandel, Dumba, suter, johannsen, pelech, provorov, coture, galchenyuk, simmons, kuznetzov
slightly agree with-graves, Manson, skjei, trouba, Vasi, binnington, Pearson
slightly disagree with-kane, Lindell, Bertuzzi, Price, Kapanen, wood
strongly disagree with-keller, MAF, Connor

Nov. 2, 2020 at 4:25 p.m.

#22

KingLundqvist30

Breadman likes Bread

Joined: Jul. 2017

Posts: 3,492

Likes: 1,729

A lot of these are way off.

Kane is still a top 10 winger.

Fleury is definitely a HOF’er. Guy carried Pittsburgh for years.

Pearson could get 40 points when healthy. Definitely a 3rd-2nd line player.

Connor, really? He’s 23 years old with three 30+ goal seasons (one of those being this year where he almost scored 40). Advanced stats don’t mean anything when you have a 30+ goal scorer on your team.

Bergeron is most definitely still a Selke candidate. Nobody works harder than he does.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 4:42 p.m.

#23

JToller1

J. Toller

Joined: Feb. 2020

Posts: 635

Likes: 151

Valid points for all of these. Here’s my thoughts:
ANA: I agree. Manson should not be up there with Fowler, but I don’t understand the Nylander comparison.
ARI: He’s maybe a 2nd line winger at most, but then again most of Arizona’s forwards aren’t that good if he’s your best forward.
BOS: He’s still an umbelievable center for this team. With Marchand and Pastrnak out for at least the first few months of the season, he’s gonna carry that first line.
BUF: I agree 1000%. He’s not that good and although he’s 26 and still has some potential, he’s not gonna be on the level of a Rasmus Dahlin.
CGY: I wouldn’t say Monahan is the most overrated player on that team. Gaudreau’s goal scoring fell off a cliff after last season. I think he’s getting too much spotlight up in Calgary, while Monahan has been kind of left out a little bit.
CAR: If I had to choose one, it’d be Petr Mrazek. He’s just not as good as previous seasons with a better defensive team to play in front of him no less.
CHI: I agree to an extent. Kane’s a shell of his former self and has young replacements like DeBrincat and Kubalik, but no one can rival his puck skills still to this day. Plus, he’s still well under 35. He’s got lots left in the tank.
COL: I agree with the Graves argument. He’s good because he can play with anyone and keep up the pace. That’s the reason Bednar kept him on the first pair with Makar.
CBJ: I would never say Jones is the most overrated player in the league. He’s only not good because he was surrounded with nothing this season. He can play big minutes and similar to Graves, he can play with faster paced players like Werenski.
DAL: Ah legendary Olympic diver no less. He’s a defensive defenseman, and that’s what he is paid to do, but he should never be paid more than Klingberg, no matter what contract Klingberg takes.
DET: Valid point. Basically their whole team is overrated. If Vlad Namestnikov is your 4th best forward, there are serious issues. Larkin and Mantha get most praise they deserve, but Bertuzzi only went to the all-stars because Larkin wanted time off.
EDM: Fair point, but could you imagine Barrie with Klefbom whenever he comes back? :O
FLA: Plus, his iron-man streak of around 900 straight games (even after getting blastes in the face by Pesce). I agree with his 5v5 going off a cliff. His special teams keeps him on that roster.
LAK: That’s it. Nailed it.
MTL: I don’t think I’ve heard people call Carey Price a top 3 goaltender. He’s obviously a starter, and he still has a lot of Carey Price left in him, but he’s still 35. He’s gonna slow down within the next 2 years.
MIN: I 100% agree. I would put Parise as either a close 3rd or a heavy front-runner due to that god awful contract.
NSH: Same with LA. That’s it.
NJD: I think the only reason he stayed was bc he’s a decent penalty killer. Also, most of this team is barely NHLers and still procpects in the making.
NYI: Ok let’s be real here. This one is waay off. There are so many players that are more overrated than Pelech (Boychuk, Komarov, Ladd just to list a few).
NYR: I’m surprised he was signed to that deal. I said that they were going to choke on that deal immediately, and I was right.
OTT: But for the Sens, he’s probably a 2nd line center lol. I agree. He was a bust looking back.
PHI: I mostly disagree. When I saw that he was on the PP I called a therapist for Alain Vigneault.
PIT: That first reason was basically the only reason Pittsburgh traded for him. He can block shots and shoot decently, but him playing with a slowing down Crosby and Malkin is a huge mistake.
SJS: Let’s be honest. Burns in his prime would be more overrated than Couture now. He doesn’t know what the word defense is and his physical skills are declining.
STL: I think he’s overrated. Why the hell was he in for Game 6?
TBL: You don’t consider Goodrow? traded for a 1st and scored a whopping 8 goals all season?
TOR: I don’t see Simmonds as overrated. If he was overrated still, he’d have the same contract as last year.
VAN: I don’t know much about Pearson so I can’t really comment on him.
VGK: Fleury is going to the hall of fame. He’s 5th overall in wins and has started over 800 games, has 3 rings, and a 5-time all-star.
WSH: Ovi or Carlson will never be overrated. Ovi’s within 150 of Gretzky’s record and Carlson was 2nd in Norris voting this year. I feel like Holtby was more overrated and overshadowed by Samsonov.
WPG: I agree with Connor.

deys3232 liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 5:22 p.m.

#24

bhavikp27

Joined: Jun. 2016

Posts: 12,584

Likes: 5,455

Quoting: JToller1

MTL: I don’t think I’ve heard people call Carey Price a top 3 goaltender. He’s obviously a starter, and he still has a lot of Carey Price left in him, but he’s still 35. He’s gonna slow down within the next 2 years.

You must be new then. There's so many people that still think Price is the best G/top3/top5 in the league. He's 33*.

" NYI: Ok let’s be real here. This one is waay off. There are so many players that are more overrated than Pelech (Boychuk, Komarov, Ladd just to list a few). "

Most people know they suck I think

" VGK: Fleury is going to the hall of fame. He’s 5th overall in wins and has started over 800 games, has 3 rings, and a 5-time all-star. "

" Fleury is going to the hall of fame "
I can't deny that. He will even though he shouldn't

" He’s 5th overall in wins, has 3 rings "
Wins/Cups are a team stat/achievement

" has started over 800 games "
This is not telling you how good he was (quality of starts), it only tells you about the quantity

" 5-time all star "
Mix of my two previous answers; voters rely on Wins and GAA, which are team stats

Let me ask you something: if he was that good, why did he never win a Vezina? Not even among the finalists?

Read this
https://jfresh.substack.com/p/marc-andre-fleury-is-the-most-overrated

deys3232 liked this.

Nov. 2, 2020 at 6:06 p.m.

#25

Rokk

You owe us picks

Joined: Jun. 2020

Posts: 447

Likes: 163

Quoting: JToller1

Valid points for all of these. Here’s my thoughts:
NYI: Ok let’s be real here. This one is waay off. There are so many players that are more overrated than Pelech (Boychuk, Komarov, Ladd just to list a few).

I don't think I've ever heard any Islander ever, say these three are worth anything...lol...trust me no ones over rating them they just want to dump their salaries a bag of hockey pucks is all we ask in return.

As for Pelech, they had a 17 game unbeaten and were near the top of the division when he was in the line up. But when he went down with an injury they went 6-11-7 allowing a crap ton of other teams catch them and pass them. I firmly believe if wasn't for the pandemic shutting the season down they would have missed the play offs altogether.

When Pelech came back for the playoffs the Islanders made it to the ECF. He's far from over rated and he's a huge part of the Islanders system and one of the best defensive defenseman in the league. At least as far as Islander fans are concerned. Not every top defenseman needs to be an offensive wonder kid.

JToller1 liked this.

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